With that, the blog is closed for today. Please see our full summary of the hearing here, and thanks for reading!
What’s next for TikTok?
It’s hard to know where we go from here.
Members of the committee appeared unwavering in their conviction that TikTok was a tool that could be exploited by the CCP – a conviction that was ultimately bolstered by today’s WSJ report indicating the Chinese government would not approve a sale of TikTok.
Lawmakers outside of the committee are also unconvinced. US Senators Mark R Warner and John Thune said in a statement that all Chinese companies “are ultimately required to do the bidding of Chinese intelligence services, should they be called upon to do so” and that nothing Chew said in his testimony assuaged those concerns. Colorado Senator Michael Bennet reiterated calls for an all out ban of TikTok, saying that Chew’s testimony is a departure from what Chew told Bennet in a private meeting weeks prior to the hearing.
“When he was in my office, the CEO admitted to me that my interpretation of Chinese law was correct, which was that any time the CPP wanted to say: we’re going to have the data turned over, that ByteDance, and therefore TikTok, had a legal obligation to turn that data over. Now he’s saying something different in his testimony to the committee.”
But a coalition of civil liberties, privacy and security groups including Fight for the Future, the Center for Democracy and Technology and the American Civil Liberties Union have written a letter opposing a ban, arguing that it would violate constitutional rights to freedom of expression.
“If passed by Congress and enacted into law, a nationwide ban on TikTok would have serious ramifications for free expression in the digital sphere, infringing on Americans’ First Amendment rights and setting a potent and worrying precedent in a time of increased censorship of internet users around the world,” the letter reads.
Where the coalition and many members of the House committee agree is that there is a pressing need for a federal data privacy regulation that protects consumer information.
Multiple members of the House committee on energy and commerce mentioned a proposed federal bipartisan privacy bill, the American Data Privacy Act, and the need for such a regulation to rein in TikTok. The coalition agrees: federal regulations could address the data-privacy issues the entire tech industry shares with TikTok.
“A comprehensive consumer privacy bill would limit data commodification, thereby dramatically increasing users’ security online. A robust privacy bill could address concerns not just at TikTok but across the multiple social media platforms,” the letter continues.
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That’s a wrap: key takeaways from today’s hearing
The first appearance in Congress for TikTok CEO Shou Zi Chew stretched more than five hours, with contentious questioning targeting the app’s relationship with China and protections for its youngest users.
Here are some key themes focused on today.
TikTok’s relationship to China
Many members of the committee focused in on TikTok’s parent company ByteDance and executives there who lawmakers say have ties to the Chinese Communist party.
The committee members asked how frequently Chew was in contact with them, and questioned whether the company’s proposed solution, called Project Texas, would offer sufficient protection against Chinese laws that require companies to make user data accessible to the government.
At one point, Tony Cárdenas, a Democrat from California, asked Chew outright if TikTok is a Chinese company. Chew responded that TikTok is global in nature, not available in mainland China, and headquartered in Singapore and Los Angeles.
Neal Dunn, a Republican from Florida, asked with similar bluntness whether ByteDance has “spied on American citizens” – a question that came amid reports the company accessed journalists’ information in an attempt to identify which employees were leaking information. Chew responded that “spying is not the right way to describe it”.
Project Texas and user data
In an effort to deflect concerns about Chinese influence, TikTok has pledged to relocate all US user data to servers outside of China through an effort titled Project Texas.
The company has promised to complete the effort by the end of the year, but some lawmakers questioned whether that is possible, with hundreds of millions of lines of source code requiring review in a relatively short amount of time.
“I am concerned that what you’re proposing with Project Texas just doesn’t have the technical capability of providing us the assurances that we need,” the California Republican Jay Obernolte, a software engineer, said.
Youth safety on TikTok
Another frequent focus of today’s hearing was safety of TikTok’s young users, as the app has exploded in popularity with the age group in recent years.
Today, a majority of teens in the US say they use TikTok – with 67% of people ages 13 to 17 saying they have used the app and 16% of that age group saying they use it “almost constantly”, according to the Pew Research Center.
Lawmakers cited reports that drug-related content has spread on the app, allowing teens to purchase dangerous substances easily online.
Chew said such content violates TikTok policy and that they are removed when identified.
“We take this very seriously,” Chew said. “This is an industry-wide challenge, and we’re investing as much as we can. We don’t think it represents the majority of the users’ experience on TikTok, but it does happen.”
Others cited self-harm, and eating disorder content have been spreading on the platform. TikTok is also facing lawsuits over deadly “challenges” that have gone viral on the app.
“We need you to do your part,” said congresswoman Kim Schrier, who is a pediatrician. “It could save this generation.”
Updated
Today’s hearing stretched over five hours and included some tense exchanges on everything from TikTok’s relationship to China to the safeguarding of young users.
Here are some of the most striking images:
And with that, the hearing has come to a close. Stay tuned for some key takeaways from the congressional grilling of TikTok CEO Shou Zi Chew that lasted over five hours.
Updated
Here’s video of a key moment from earlier in the hearing.
Republican Kat Cammack showed Congress a TikTok video inciting violence towards the House energy and commerce committee, with the chair of the committee named in the captions. The video was uploaded to the platform 41 days ago and was still circulating despite company guidelines assuring users it would take down threatening content.
Shou Zi Chew was denied a chance to respond to Cammack’s claims by the chair. The video was removed from TikTok during the hearing.
Updated
TikTok CEO questioned over drug accessibility on the platform
Several Congress members took the opportunity on Thursday to question Chew about drug concerns on TikTok. Angie Craig of Minnesota referenced a Washington Post report from earlier this month that showed drugs are easily accessible on the platform.
“What are you going to do to move past these token efforts to prevent teenagers from accessing drugs on your platform?” she asked.
In the past TikTok has directed users who search certain drug-related hashtags, like “fentanyl” to resource pages. Craig suggested that users seeking drugs would likely not use hashtags, and that dealers are able to bypass such measures using different hashtag spellings and emojis.
“We do take illegal illegal drugs content on our platform very seriously – it violates our guidelines,” Chew said. He added that the company is working to more proactively find drug-related content.
Rick Allen also questioned Chew about drug-related content on TikTok, noting a 2021 investigation from the Wall Street Journal that revealed the app served an account purporting to be 13 years old more than 500 videos about drug use.
Chew said such content violates TikTok policy and that they are removed when identified.
“We take this very seriously,” he said. “This is an industry-wide challenge, and we’re investing as much as we can. We don’t think it represents the majority of the users’ experience on TikTok, but it does happen.”
Updated
Upon return from break, Congress questioning continued to take a harsh tone, hours into a grilling of Chew.
Texas representative Randy Weber was aggressive with his time on the floor, accusing TikTok of “indoctrinating” American kids with “divisive, woke, and pro-CCP content”.
“If this committee gets its way, TikTok’s time is up,” he said.
Shortly after, Morgan Griffith of Virginia accused TikTok of being an agent of the Chinese Communist party as well. “Is it part of the Chinese Communist party as everybody thinks, or are you still living in some mystical world?” he asked.
Updated
We are back in session, with testy questioning from Congress continuing. Stay tuned for more.
The hearing has entered recess and will reconvene in a bit. Stand by for updates.
Congresswoman Kim Schrier, who is a pediatrician, asked Chew a number of questions about TikTok’s impact on young users’ health.
The issue has been a central concern in today’s hearing, which is titled TikTok: How Congress Can Safeguard American Data Privacy and Protect Children from Online Harms. Schrier said TikTok has been particularly dangerous for children during the pandemic, when social media was already replacing in-person interactions.
“Social media is designed to be addicting, and your platform is the most addictive of all,” she said. “And this endless, mindless scrolling takes teams away from human relationships.”
She added that TikTok is keeping teens awake “well past their bedtimes” at a time when “sleep is critical for brain and physical development”. She also noted that there is a large amount of harmful content on the app encouraging eating disorders.
Chew said TikTok has worked with experts to tackle such content and is building models to identify and remove it more quickly. “Anything that glorifies eating disorders we remove,” he said. “It’s something we take very seriously.”
Previous Guardian reporting showed that hashtags promoting eating disorders frequently evaded bans on TikTok. Teens attempting to recover from disordered eating described being trapped in algorithmic bubbles that fed them dangerous content. Schrier encouraged Chew to expedite responses to these concerns.
“We need you to do your part,” she said. “It could save this generation.”
Updated
Republican representative Neal Dunn of Florida outright asked: “Has ByteDance spied on American citizens?”
The question comes after reports emerged in 2022 that the company accessed location data of reporters in an attempt to identify which employees were leaking information. Chew responded that “spying is not the right way to describe it”.
Rep. Neal Dunn (R-FL): "Has ByteDance spied on American citizens?"
— Bloomberg (@business) March 23, 2023
TikTok CEO Shou Chew: "I don’t think that spying is the right way to describe it." https://t.co/nDBYu0zswn pic.twitter.com/wowEKe5o9E
Chew says his own children are not on TikTok
Driving home concerns about young users on TikTok, Congresswoman Nanette Barragán asked Chew about reports that he does not let his own children use the app. “At what age do you think it would be appropriate for a young person to get on TikTok?” she said.
Chew said his children are not on TikTok because in Singapore, where they live, there is not a version of the platform for users under the age of 13. In the US there is a version of “TikTok for Younger Users” in which the content is curated for a younger audience.
“Our approach is to give differentiated experiences for different age groups and let the parents have conversations with their children to decide what’s best for their family,” he said.
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Lawmaker raises 'concerns' about Project Texas data management plan
California Republican Jay Obernolte, who is a software engineer, asked a series of technical questions of Chew relating to how TikTok plans to manage US user data in the future.
The questions related to Project Texas – an effort TikTok is carrying out to relocate all US user data to domestic servers. As part of the project, US tech firm Oracle is going through lines of TikTok source code – a massive undertaking.
“I am concerned that what you’re proposing with Project Texas just doesn’t have the technical capability of providing us the assurances that we need,” Obernolte said.
Obernolte said that concerns raised by TikTok are not unique to the Chinese company and called for better protections for Americans.
“Social media companies gather a tremendous amount of user data and then use powerful AI tools to use that data to make really accurate predictions of human behavior, and then seek to manipulate that behavior,” he said.
“That’s not just TikTok – it’s all social media companies that are doing this. Ultimately, the solution is to enact comprehensive federal data privacy legislation that will prevent that kind of behavior, or at least allow users to consent to it.”
Updated
US representative Tony Cárdenas, a Democrat from California, asked the CEO outright if TikTok is a Chinese company.
Chew said TikTok is global in nature, not available in mainland China, and headquartered in Singapore and Los Angeles.
Cárdenas again underscored the bipartisan nature of today’s hearing.
“You have been one of the few members to unite this committee,” he told Chew.
Kari Paul here on the west coast, taking over the blog for the remainder of Chew’s hearing. Stand by for updates.
Updated
Mid-morning summary
The hearing is now in recess. As expected, two hours into the hearing we’re still hitting on a lot of the same questions.
Does the CCP control TikTok decisions, either directly or indirectly?
How does TikTok get around CCP laws that require companies provide access to user data?
How does the company plan to alleviate the harmful impacts of its platform on teen mental health?
It doesn’t appear many lawmakers are interested in hearing Chew’s response and in some cases rarely give him the opportunity to fully respond to their questions. That said, Chew is also repeating much of the same lines from his opening testimony when responding to questions. The WSJ report today, which has been cited by members of the committee at least three times, has not helped Chew at all given the impression lawmakers have from that story is that China would have control over whether or not ByteDance could be sold.
Members have also used this hearing as an opportunity to promote their efforts to pass a federal privacy bill that limits how user data is collected and shared.
Two moments have stood out as potentially damaging to Chew’s testimony. First, when Cammack pulled up a TikTok post that appeared to threaten the committee and the committee chair that had not been taken down by the company 41 days after it was first posted. Second, when Gus Bilirakis shared the story of Chase Nasca who died by suicide. Bilirakis alleged that it was TikTok content that lead him to do that and then proceeded to play a series of videos that discussed suicide.
Updated
Representative Brett Guthrie goes back to the threatening video that Cammack presented and asks why and how it’s been up for 41 days.
“We had a threat against our committee … you seem to be able to prevent this content in China … and yet it’s on your website,” Guthrie said. “You said earlier as soon as you find this information you take it down. How quickly does your algorithm detect keywords or content that involve illicit drug trafficking before these posts are self-reported or used by others?
Chew says there are 40,000 moderators working on this, alongside automated systems … but no company can be perfect.
Guthrie is expressing confusion on why Douyin, the ByteDance-owned China-based version of TikTok, is able to stamp out illicit drugs content entirely but TikTok isn’t able to do that.
Chew said you have to deal with the reality of the country you’re operating in, but that it’s a shared challenge with other tech companies in the US. Essentially drug laws aren’t as strict here as it is in China.
Updated
TikTok CEO pressed on youth mental health
Representative John Sarbanes is asking whether TikTok is looking into how to make its platform less “manipulative”. Chew said the company was the first to implement the 60-minute watch limit and also prohibits users under 16 to use direct messages. Users under 16 also can’t go viral by design, Chew said.
But Sarbanes points out that teens have been able to bypass the 60-minute time limit. “If you concluded that putting some reasonable limits in place … would lead some percentage of your users to leave TikTok and go somewhere else is that something you’re prepared to accept?”
Chew said yes.
Updated
Lawmakers are focusing more on teen and children mental health on TikTok now.
Representative Gus Bilirakis shares a story of Chase Nasca, a 16-year-old boy who ended his life a year ago by stepping in front of a train.
“I want to thank his parents for being here today, and allowing us to show this,” Bilirakis said. “Mr Chew your company destroyed their lives. I admire their courage to be here and share Chase’s story in the hopes it’ll prevent this from happening to other families. The content in Chase’s “For You” page wasn’t a window to discovery … instead his “For You” page was sadly a window to discover suicide. It is unacceptable, sir, that even after knowing all these dangers you still [contend] TikTok is something grand to behold.”
Bilirakis then played a series of TikToks that promote suicidal ideation.
“Do you have responsibility over the algorithms used by TikTok to prioritize content for its users,” he asks Chew.
In his answer, Chew attempted to emphasize that TikTok shares mental health resources but Bilirakis pushes him on the question, taking his attempts to address what TikTok is doing to help teen mental health as a means to avoid answering his question or accept responsibility.
Updated
CEO asked why violent content not removed
Representative Kat Cammack has presented a video that was posted 41 days ago that shows a gun being shot. The text over the video says “me ASF at the House Energy and Commerce Committee…” and the caption includes the name of the chair of the committee, Cathy McMorris Rodgers.
“I think this is a blatant display of how vulnerable people who use TikTok are, you couldn’t take action after 41 days when a clear threat, a very violent threat to the chairwoman of this committee and the members of this committee was posted on your platform,” Cammack said. “You damn well know that you cannot protect the data and security of this committee or the 150 million users of your app because it’s an extension of the CCP.”
The chair did not allow Chew to respond.
Updated
Important to note that members of the committee have repeatedly tried to establish Chew’s connection with ByteDance executives – some of whom, they say, work with or are affiliated with the CCP.
Representative Diana DeGette is bringing up the WSJ report again and asking Chew for comment. He said that he’d have to get back to them because whether ByteDance would be forced to sell TikTok is still developing so he doesn’t have specifics but that Project Texas would protect US users no matter what.
“Does TikTok share user information … overseas?” Degette asked. Chew said in the past, yes but with Project Texas that would no longer be the case. He reiterated that the efforts to protect user data through Project Texas is more than any other company has done.
Updated
Representative Richard Hudson asked Chew about the reports that ByteDance employees have accessed user data of US journalists in order to investigate an internal leak of information. Chew says TikTok condemns this behavior.
“We took swift disciplinary action against employees and are implementing measures to make sure this doesn’t happen again,” he said.
Updated
Representative Anna Eshoo has asked how TikTok could get around Beijing’s security laws that require companies to provide data to the government and makes the reach of the law “extra-territorial”. “This is very clear,” Eshoo said. “Those are the laws of the PRC, how does TikTok convince the congress of the US that there can be a clean break? Why would the Chinese government sidestep their national law … in terms of user data?”
Chew reiterated the plan is to move American data to American soil. Eshoo is not satisfied: “How can you promise the data will move to the US and be protected here?”
Chew said he has seen no evidence that the Chinese government has access to our data. “They haven’t asked us,” he said.
Eshoo said she doesn’t believe there’s a private sector in China. “When you look at their national law … I think there is a real problem relative to our national security about the protection of the user data.”
Updated
Members of the committee have cited a Wall Street Journal report that indicates China would oppose a forced sale of TikTok.
“China’s Commerce Ministry said Thursday that a sale or divestiture of TikTok would involve exporting technology and had to be approved by the Chinese government,” the article reads.
Representative Michael Burgess said despite Chew’s assertions, China seems to believe its in control of TikTok and its software.
Chew said that while TikTok is not available in mainland China, the founders of ByteDance are Chinese and they work with Chinese employees just like many companies around the world.
Burgess has asked whether anyone from ByteDance “directly provide input, help or instruction for your testimony today”. Chew said he prepared for this hearing with his team in DC.
As a reminder, ByteDance is TikTok’s parent company.
Updated
Pallone said that he doesn’t believe Project Texas is sufficient and that the CCP will still be able to access data.
Now he’s asking about some of TikTok’s financials including how much money the company makes off of targeted ads. Chew refuses to share it because the company is private and thus its financials are also private.
“My concern here is primarily about the privacy issue the fact that TikTok is making all kinds of money by gathering private information about Americans … and then they sell it,” Pallone said, bringing up the privacy legislation he and Rodgers are pushing. “Would you commit to not selling data to anyone?”
Chew said the company doesn’t sell data to data brokers, Pallone says he is talking about selling or sharing data to anyone. Chew said he’ll get back to him on the details.
Chew said the company is committed to being transparent about data they collect and that he doesn’t believe the company collects any more data than any other tech platform. Pallone said that he’s not his point: He knows all tech companies collect data he doesn’t think they should and wants to see if Tiktok would commit to being a good actor and stop collecting data.
Updated
Rodgers asked Chew whether he has regular contact with various executives at Bytedance. He said he was in regular contact with the parent company’s CEO.
“All of these individuals work or are affiliated with the Chinese Communist party and are at the highest levels of leadership of ByteDance,” Rodgers responded. “A company where you previously served as CFO and where you regularly communicate with the CEO.”
Updated
Shou Zi Chew, TikTok’s CEO, is beginning his testimony with an emphasis on his Singaporean heritage. He has tried this strategy before in a letter to lawmakers when he first took over the company. TikTok is run by a Singaporean based in Singapore, he wrote in that letter, and not beholden to the Chinese government.
Chew is also emphasizing that the company’s 150 million users in the US use the platform for various purposes that includes educational videos.
To address the lawmakers’ national security concerns, Chew is talking about Project Texas – an effort to move all US data to domestic servers. He said the company is deleting all user data that is backed up to servers outside the US, and that it should all be deleted later this year.
“Trust is about actions we take, we have to earn your trust with decisions we make … the potential security, privacy … concerns are not unique to us. We believe what’s needed are clear transparent rules that address all tech companies,” Chew said.
He ends with this: “There are more than 150 million users who love our platform and we know we have a responsibility to protect them which is why I am making the following commitments to you and all our users:
1) We will keep safety, particularly for teenagers as a top priority for us.
2) We will firewall protected US data from unwanted foreign access
3) TikTok will remain a place for free expression and not be manipulated by any government
4) We will be transparent and we will give access to third-party independent monitors to remain accountable for our commitments.”
Updated
Ranking member Frank Pallone, a Democrat of New Jersey, is focused more on the spread of misinformation on TikTok, and the platform’s impact on teen mental health. He’s also taking this opportunity to speak to urge the passage of a bill that would create a federal privacy law that would reign in all of big tech’s data-collection practices.
Updated
Good morning, the hearing has started.
Representative Cathy McMorris Rodgers, the chair of the House energy and commerce committee, spoke passionately about her concerns with TikTok’s parent company, ByteDance. The main thrust of her argument is that TikTok poses a “grave threat” from foreign influence on American life. She claims that China requires companies to allow the government to access its data, by design.
Rodgers tells Chew that he has to not just answer to Congress but also to the American people.
Updated
TikTok CEO to begin testimony shortly
Good morning and welcome to our liveblog of today’s interrogation of TikTok CEO Shou Zi Chew by US Congress members.
The panel, convened by the House committee on energy and commerce, will begin at 10am ET and is titled TikTok: How Congress Can Safeguard American Data Privacy And Protect Children From Online Harms.
This marks the first appearance from a TikTok chief executive before US lawmakers. It comes as the political storm surrounding the China-owned social media platform intensifies, with the Biden administration threatening to ban the app entirely in the US.
TikTok, which is owned by the Chinese company ByteDance, has long faced criticisms over the data it holds on US users – data that lawmakers fear could fall into the hands of the Chinese government.
According to prepared statements shared in advance, Chew is anticipated to insist that TikTok has never, and would never, share US user data with the Chinese government, nor let the state manipulate what content is shown on the platform.
“Let me state this unequivocally: ByteDance is not an agent of China or any other country,” Chew said.
Stay tuned for more updates as the hearing gets under way.
