Warren Gatland is back at the old office. Just a few metres away from the Principality Stadium coaches box in which he used to sit he appears - this time donning a cap and gown.
The former Wales boss, who spent over a decade on these shores and won three Grand Slams, a further Six Nations title, reaching two World Cup semi-finals, is back in the capital to receive an honorary fellowship from Cardiff University. It is a recognition of what he achieved during his time here.
Gatland returned to New Zealand soon after finishing with Wales in 2019 and this is the first time he has returned since the Covid-19 pandemic eased. The Kiwi is in the middle of a mini-tour of sorts. A stop-off in London to catch up with friends and some time in the Lake District, before heading over to Ireland to see some more familiar faces.
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But Cardiff University’s acknowledgement and the reception he still receives as he wanders the capital's streets lets him know that he truly left a legacy in the country that adopted him. He tells Wales Online: “From my point of view the fact I’ve been away for a few years but people still recognise you when you come back, people still say, ‘It’s great to see you’ and ‘Thanks very much’, that’s when it hits home that maybe you did have some impact.
“It’s been nice to come back and you get people stopping you in the street, asking for a photo and what I’m up to, asking if I’m here for a job! Yeah, at times it was a bit of a rollercoaster because we’re in a small country. But when you look back at what we achieved it was pretty special.
“I loved my time here and I love the people here. That made it so much easier to stay.
“It was challenging at times because of how knowledgeable the Welsh are about rugby... and they’re very opinionated! But I didn’t mind that stuff.”
Since leaving Wales Gatland has headed up the Lions tour to South Africa and is currently in a director of rugby role with the Chiefs in his hometown of Waikato. But as he peruses the scene of some of his greatest triumphs down on the pitch below us as we talk, it begs the question: does he miss coaching here in Wales?
“Absolutely, yeah,” he says without hesitation. “I often get asked about the club stuff compared to international rugby. There is more pressure in Test rugby because you’re under a huge amount of scrutiny and it’s about results as much as anything.
“You’re here in the Principality Stadium, it’s full, you get the buzz of the day, the pressure of performing. When you win you realise the impact that it has on a nation.
“There are pressures but there is also a huge amount of reward. The club season is much longer and you’re a bit more involved in the development of players over a season. You can try things, fail, and it doesn’t impact too much on the season. But unless you make the semi-finals or finals you don’t quite get the same buzz as you did when you turned up at the Principality Stadium.”
Before Gatland left he admitted it would "break my heart" if his departure signalled a regression to the state in which he found the Welsh team way back in 2008. There have been peaks and troughs since his departure. Under Wayne Pivac Wales have won the Six Nations but then lost to Italy a year later. Most recently they secured a first win over South Africa in their own backyard but ultimately lost the summer Test series 2-1.
Among other things Gatland praised Pivac’s "smart" selection of rookie openside flanker Tommy Reffell. “You’re picking a player who has just won the Premiership. Often, with me, you were trying to pick players that were coming from successful teams. That has a knock-on effect – just that confidence to come in and be used to winning, be used to being on the front foot.”
And he is also excited by the development of players who were not really in the picture before he departed and believes Wales can take confidence into next year’s Rugby World Cup season.
“Will Rowlands has developed in the last couple of years. It took him a while to adjust to the step up to international rugby but he’s definitely come through,” says Gatland. “Dewi Lake looks good so there’s going to be some real competition in the hooker position over the next few years.
“It was pleasing to see them front up a little bit after the disappointment of the Six Nations. I thought they showed a bit of character and Dan [Biggar] did a great job in terms of his leadership.
“They were smart in the way they played, particularly in the first couple of games. They made sure they stayed in the arm wrestle and put themselves in a position to win the first Test. They’ll be disappointed with how it finished up in the end.
“I thought the second Test was a great result with Josh [Adams] scoring late on and Gareth [Anscombe] kicking the conversion. The third Test was a little bit of a step too far but I think they can hold their heads high and think, ‘On our day, when we get everything right, we’ve still got the ability to compete and there is 12 months to get ourselves right for a World Cup’.”
Two players that Gatland is extremely familiar with, Dan Biggar and Alun Wyn Jones, have been at the heart of a key talking point surrounding the current squad. Jones, who was made skipper by Gatland, has since lost that title, which has now been bestowed upon Biggar for the last two campaigns. The fly-half has always been a leader in the group but the fear was that his emotions could, at times, get the better of him.
“Dan and I used to have conversations about that,” laughs Gatland. “There is no doubt he’s emotionally invested. It means so much to him, the performance and the result. He’s a winner.
“If he does continue in that role as captain I think he’ll get more comfortable with it. The discussion I used to have with him was that, as a 10, you’ve got to almost be unemotional in the way you portray yourself. Not just to the fans and the referee but to your team-mates.
“He was a guy who was critical, pivotal to us, and he’s relaxed, he’s thinking about the next play, he knows what he’s doing. Sometimes the criticism was that Dan hasn’t always been that way.
“But I wouldn’t want to take that edge away – it’s about finding the right balance in the emotional stuff because you know he’s the sort of guy that if you’re defending on the goal-line he’s coming hard off the line and he’s going to put his body on the line.”
And what of his former skipper Alun Wyn? The most-capped player in the history of the game is having to get used to life as a replacement under Pivac with Rowlands and Adam Beard the preferred choices at lock. It’s an unfamiliar position for him to be in.
“He’ll be fine,” Gatland insists. “As a coaching group you’ll sit back and assess what happens at the start of next season, how everyone’s form is, and make your decisions accordingly.
“He’s obviously done a great job. First of all he’s got to push his way past Will and Beardy. You never write him off. I wouldn’t want to challenge him because he’ll prove you wrong.
“Those are the sort of things that drive him. The bigger the challenge the more he’s up for it.
“But, in saying that, it’s also about what’s best for the team. He’s been around long enough to know that if it is time for a change and there is another role for him to do then he’ll accept that.”
Our time is nearly up but one question must be asked before he departs to receive his fellowship. It’s about the future.
A coach of Gatland’s pedigree will always attract interest and he is linked with some of the top jobs in the world, including the England one, at regular intervals. He remains coy on what lies ahead but it’s difficult to envisage the three-time Lions boss being out of the Test arena for too long.
He laughs before I finish the question: “I’ve got my contract in New Zealand which finishes next year. I’m just keeping my options open really.
“I loved my time in the northern hemisphere. I don’t know what I’m going to do when my contract in New Zealand finishes. It’s just about being smart really and potentially at some stage seeing what’s out there.”
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