HBO's The Last of Us finished its first season last night with a finale that's got everyone talking.
Catch up with your fellow survivors and the discussion about exactly what happened, and what might be on the horizon for season two.
SPOILER WARNING: In case there was any doubt, we discussed the entirety of season one of HBO's The Last of Us as well as the plot of the first video game. There are no spoilers for season two or The Last of Us Part II game.
Key events
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Live updates
Thanks for being here folks!
By Peter Marsh
We're going to leave it there for today. Thanks so much for joining in the discussion! I've adored reading your comments, even if I wasn't able to post them all (even your recent one about the sequel LW which I CAN NOT share).
Let's hope the wait for season two isn't too long, and maybe let's do this all again to get ourselves ready for it before it comes out.
I'm off to listen to some Linda Rondstadt and eat strawberries.
A look at what season 2 might have in store
By Peter Marsh
Ok ... so by now you know The Last of Us got a sequel (called helpfully, Part II) and the TV show is going to get one too.
So, how does this story continue?
In an extremely NON-SPOILERY way of describing it, Part II is set four-years after the events of season one. Joel and Ellie have since built a life in Jackson with Tommy and Maria.
But of course, ~ things happen ~, and the pair are once again called to action. That's about all I can tell you without spoiling it.
I've got some spoiler-safe trailers if you're eager for a peek. Fair warning ... both of these contain plenty of the violence and gore you've come to expect.
This first one is the most ambiguous:
This second one is the official story trailer released BEFORE the game made it to players hands. There are still no major spoilers here, but you'll get a bigger look at what the next part of this story might have in store:
Before we wrap ... let's talk Season 2
By Peter Marsh
If you're SUPER nervous about anything related to the next seaosn (which will be drawn from Part II of the game) ... now is your time to leave.
As a heads up for everyone, all I'm going to show you is stuff that was shown BEFORE The Last of Us Part II came out. We're not going to discuss anything that happens in that game, only peep at the trailers that came out prior to its release.
Alright ... let's open the floor shall we?
By Peter Marsh
That ending was SOMETHING ... but the rest of the show had some amazing moments as well. Tell me what your favourite part of the season was.
For me, it's impossible to go past Bill and Frank.That was a massive, risky change to the narrative.
And yet we got a nearly perfect episode of television. Nick Offerman and Our Murray Bartlett acted their socks off and locked up every award in 10 months' time. STRAWBERRIES.
I don't know about you, but I was left a sobbing mess.
Watch The Last of Us or Play The Last of Us?
By Peter Marsh
I'm possibly in the minority here but I do think that the game is measurably better than the show. But we're talking like a 9.8/10 vs 9.1/10 The two differences for me are that I prefer Troy Baker's Joel and Ash Johnson's Ellie to Pedro's and Bellas. Second is that in playing the game, the morality hits harder because it's YOU doing the violence.
- LW
As someone who’s too scared to play the game (and also doesn’t have the console), I instead watched a walkthrough of TLOU Part 1 after each episode and LOVED it. So interesting comparing the two versions and getting the extra context it provided. Do you think I’d be ruining things for myself if I watched a walkthrough of Part 2? I’m dying to know what happens next but also aware that season two of the show could be 2+ years away.
- Meghan
Meghan you've done EXACTLY what I'd recommend anyone do who is kinda lost right now and isn't ready to say goodbye to this world just yet.
The Last of Us game is a pretty cinematic experience, it's part of why it translated so well to TV. But there are a million playthroughs of the game if you want to go and see what the differences are for yourself. Here's a link to one that Neil Druckmann himself endorsed.
As for Part II ... if you're eager to keep exploring this story I'd say just dive in and watch another playthrough. Part II is a great game to watch for the same reason Part I is. You won't be ruining anything!
Another difference between the game and the show
By Peter Marsh
All season long eager eyed fans have been picking up on some of tweaks the HBO adaption has been making from the original 2013 game.
But there was a key differernce, beyond a line or setting or a character, that struck me last night.
In 2013, there was no guarantee The Last of Us Part II was ever going to happen. For all we knew, Ellie's "OK" was the last line we were ever going to get in this story.
In fact, Neil Druckmann said in interviews at the time that "OK" was the end of the story for Ellie and Joel:
"I think the world is ripe for more stories, but as far as the journey Joel and Ellie goes on, it ends with this game. We were very conscious that we didn’t want to leave this story dangling. If we never do a sequel, we’re OK with it, because we told the story we needed to tell," Druckmann said.
Here in 2023, we know that's not the case. The Last of Us Part II exists. At least one more season of the HBO show is on the way.
*I* think it made those final scenes hit with just a little less oomf than it did in 2013, knowing that there's more to this story to come.
Did you view this differently if you were a parent?
By Peter Marsh
I've not played the game so only have the series to go on. If someone wanted to remove my child's brain for science, I would kill them all too, and Joel was starting to look at Ellie as a daughter of sorts. She risked her life to save him. What sort of a chump would he have been to just let the Fireflies kill her on a whim that they could create a cure. The way I saw his lie to her about how things had gone down, was really about his desire to protect her. She is still a child after all, regardless of what she had seen and done. If it was good enough for the Fireflies to withhold vital information from Ellie that would lead to her death, then it is good enough for Joel to withhold information so that she could move on with life & hopefully have a future. Joel is the good guy!
- Caraline
The perspective here matters if you're asking did Joel did the right thing. As a parent I will go to the ends of the earth to save my children. As tough as it would be I wouldn't feel 'wrong' to keep them alive.
- Parent
Super interesting points you raise here folks.
In the official podcast for the show, Neil Druckmann recounted how they had lots and lots of people playtest the final section of the game. After each, he'd ask them what they though about Joel's actions.
He said, without fail, every parent he asked said they would do what Joel did.
What the creators have to say about a "correct" answer to the finale
By Peter Marsh
It's natural when we consume stories like the Last of Us to want to look to their creators and ask "but what did you mean by that? What's the real way I'm supposed to feel?".
Co-creators of the HBO series Craig Mazin and Neil Druckmann (who was one of the creators of the original game) address exactly this on the offical podcast of the show. Here's what Mazin had to say about coming to them for answers:
"People will debate this, and people will look to this podcast for some sort of answer," Mazin said.
"And an answer will not be forthcoming because the truth is you can make an excellent arguement either way."
Yup! We're all correct and none of us are correct at the same time. Here's some more of what Craig Mazin said about how to feel about the finale of this story.
"The reality is it's a dilemma. And the point of a dilemma is it ain't easy. And there isn't one right answer.
"That's kinda the point. That as flawed human beings this is one of the prices we pay for loving people. Loving people tends to trump simple morality."
More of your feels on Ellie's moment
By Peter Marsh
That murky morality and ambiguity is one of the things that makes TLOU so great. After playing the game multiple times, the feeling I always come away with is that Ellie doesn't really believe Joel's story, but she just isn't ready to confront the truth yet.
- Rhi
I don't know if lying is the right word. I think she knows something's off, but with that OK she's deciding not to complete the thought. She's deciding not to deal with it, because she doesn't want to deal with the ramifications.
- Jess
Don’t forget the giraffe scene. This scene reminds us that Ellie is still a child. A child who has been exposed to and survived the worst of human nature. Who through all of this had one real commitment and that was to Joel. The final scene where Ellie asks if Joel if he told the truth she says ok. She knows it didn’t go down like Joel said, she knew this in the car when she asked about her clothes. But she gives him her undeniable and complete trust even knowing he’s lying yet again. She accepts that he’s again protecting her.
- Traveler 2468
Love what you're point out here Jess and Traveler. It's easy to forget that Ellie, despite EVERYTHING, is still a fourteen year old girl.
The consequences of not pushing Joel further are deep and complex and ... if it's not out of line to suggest ... maybe even a little terrifying?
A key difference between the game and the show
By Peter Marsh
One small change that stuck with me was in the final scenes with Joel and Ellie.
As Ellie is describing her final moments with Riley, both versions recount how she planned to wait it out with Riley and lose their minds together.
In the game however, Ellie says:
"I'm still waiting for my turn."
It's a line left out of the HBO adaption.
For me it was always a tiny signal that Ellie was ready to die if that's what it took to be a cure. She's watched so many people around her die, but she's been "waiting" since the very first one for it to be her turn. Ellie was ready. But Joel wasn't.
You can watch the full ending sequence below from the game if you're intrigued:
What the OG Ellie has to say about the finale
By Peter Marsh
First of all - I love that this blog exists. Where can we all gather and discuss this in person?? Second of all - I'm curious what people think about Ashley Johnson's interpretation that Ellie knows Joel is lying at the end, and that her final line ("Okay.") is essentially acknowledgment that their relationship will never be the same?? I hadn't initially interpreted it that way and now I want to cry even more ... what am I going to do without this show!!
- Ingrid
First of all Ingrid - we love that you're here. Maybe we all get together with a can of Chef Boyardee somewhere between Utah and Wyoming?
And thank you for pointing out what Ashley Johnson, who both voiced and acted Ellie in the original games, felt about the "OK". The creators often talk about how much of Ashley is in Ellie and vice versa, so she's more of an authority than most!
Also for those who didn't know, Johnson made a HEARTWRENCHING cameo in the cold open of the finale as Ellie's mother, Anna. Anyone else just *hear* game Ellie as Anna was fleeing? Those huff and puffs and grunts were all too familiar.
The season finale smashed records
By Peter Marsh
The Last of Us has been a bit of a slow burn hit for HBO.
Each episode has grown in viewership. The premiere had 4.7 million viewers in the US, making it HBO's second-largest debut behind House of the Dragon. It's now the most-watch show ever on HBO Max (a HBO streaming service we dont have in Australia) in both Europe and Latin America.
Yesterday's finale drew 8.2 million viewers in the US. And that was despite airing against the Oscars telecast.
Obviously we're in a streaming world now, so expect these numbers to grow. HBO says each episode is averaging close to 30 million viewers in the US.
Your thoughts on Ellie's last word
By Peter Marsh
The key question that was asked of Joel was ‘what would Ellie want.’ They didn’t know as they hid what was happening to her and that she was giving up her life for this. I think he did the right thing because no one gave her the chance to decide, in fact THEY lied to her. They were going to murder her. Still murder regardless of the intention. He saved her. Even though she was committed to using her immunity, she was not in a position to make a choice in giving up her own life. She’s 13 and in need of protection, even from herself. I don’t agree with him lying to her but he lied to her because he had no choice. Marlene’s promise to Ellie’s mother was to protect her, make sure she lives. Joel’s lies may have held some self interest but ultimately he was doing what he should. Protecting Ellie.
- Traveler 2468
Murder dozens of people and prevent progress of a vaccine that could save countless lives and literally your own species.... I am still with you. But telling a bare face lie when you swore it was the truth, now THAT is crossing the line. Wake up sheeple Joel is the badguy!
- Nicholas
Hands down. She’s always described as being really smart but she obviously doesn’t want to die otherwise she and Riley would’ve killed each other and she’s only 14 so it’s a lot to ask of someone to sacrifice themselves for something we don’t know even know would work. Plus she loves Joel and wouldn’t want to think badly of him
- Acceptance
I'm also in the camp that Ellie is way too smart to not have some inkling of what has happened. She might not know the full truth, but she sure as heck knows that Joel is lying.
What does Ellie's 'OK' mean?
By Peter Marsh
Joel's rampage through the hospital is only the first shot of the two-punch combo that The Last of Us finale hits us with.
The second comes not long after, when just before walking back into Jackson, Ellie confronts Joel over the story he's told her about what happened with the Fireflies.
Like Joel's own actions, Ellie's "OK" has been LONG debated.
Let's do it some more! What do you think Ellie's final word means before our screen cuts to black? Does she know Joel is lying? Is her "OK" an acceptance of the lie?
Hit the comment button and tell me what you think!
Game or Show?
By Peter Marsh
There was a lot of detail in the game that the show left out, im curious which you think did a better job at telling the story?
- Hunter
I promise you this isn't the famous ABC impartiality kicking in with this answer Hunter!
But I honestly think both did an amazing job telling this story, and as someone who's loved it since 2013 I'm just thrilled that it's now more accessible and has a whole fresh legion of fans to enjoy it with!
There are things the show did better. There are things the game did better.
But how lucky are we as fans of the OG game that when someone comes to us and asks "is it best to watch or play?" we've got an adaption SO GOOD the answer really doesn't matter.
Joel ... right AND wrong?
By Peter Marsh
The finale played out exactly as the game did. As someone who played it twice, it did it justice! But morally ... yes he did the wrong thing hahaha.
- EmilyKomiyama
Ellie saved Joel, made him more than a shell of a human being again. How could he not save her?
- CJ
If Marlene was so sure Ellie would go along with it, why not give her the choice? Instead the Fireflies showed (again?) they're no better than FEDRA who made the same decision with the child in the pilot.
- LA
You've brought up a really good point here LA.
In the show, we know that Ellie didn't know what was going to happen when she was put under because Marlene says so.
In the game however, it's never explicitly stated and left ambiguous. People have debated for 10 years whether Ellie knew what would happen once she went under, and whether or not that justified what Joel did next.
More of your thoughts on Joel's actions
By Peter Marsh
As a utilitarian, in a vacuum I feel that saving humanity was the "right" thing to do. But when I played the game the first time I was so caught up in trying to save Ellie that I killed the doctor without even thinking. So I guess I'd do the "wrong" thing too if push came to shove.
- Joel rightly did something wrong
Do I think Joel was right? No way. I'm not going to get into the debate of if the vaccine would have worked or not, but what he did stripped Ellie of her agency and worse he lied to her about it. I get why he did, and maybe I would too if I were in his shoes, but that doesn't make it right...And that's why I love Joel as a character. He's not a hero. He's a flawed man trying to hold onto love. #normalisemorallygrayprotagonists
- Mmmm, Cordyceps *drools*
Hi Peter, I thought it was really cowardly of the showrunners to not include the scene where Joel died 20 times in the hospital before torching the surgeon with a flamethrower.
- Kevin Nguyen
It only took you 20 Kev? Sheesh.
For those who haven't played the 2013 game, you gain control of Joel just after he wakes up and has the conversation with Marlene.
You then play through the entire hospital slaughter, shooting and maiming the Fireflies that swarm you to stop you from reaching Ellie. There is no other choice. You kill, or you die.
In the final room, you have two options when confronted by the doctor:
1. Use a weapon from your arsenal to kill them (including the flamethrower Kev's mentioned)
2. Press a button to use the scalpel in the doctor's hand to kill them
It's difficult, horrifying stuff to play!
Your thoughts on Joel's actions in the finale
By Peter Marsh
Similar to playing through the game many years ago - I loved the artistic way the directors were able to really direct the viewer towards the thought process of is Joel evil? is Joel the good guy? Thoroughly enjoyed the show, I will be playing through the game again, just to re-live it!
- FutureClicker
Joel did the wrong thing, but did it out of love. In the end he was selfish and cared more about Ellie than the rest of humanity. Honestly, I don't blame him.
- franfran
I just can't stop thinking about Joel's face after Marlene (rightly) asks him what Ellie would want. It's the hindsight that makes me think I should say Joel was wrong... But... I kinda want him to be right?
- Jess
I'm LOVING your comments so far folks. Keep them coming, I'll be featuring LOTS in the blog today.
Jess ... I think you're in exactly the headspace the creators want you to be in. Utterly torn between the morality of what this one person did to other people ... to all of humanity ... with his actions AND your knowledge and love of Joel and Ellie as complex humans.
Was Joel right to do what he did?
By Peter Marsh
The ending of The Last of Us is something that caused a MASSIVE stir back when it first played out in video game form in 2013.
Annnnnd it's now a whole new audience is getting to experience the shock and violence of the decision Joel makes to go on a rampage in the hospital to retreive Ellie.
So ... tell me what you thought. There's no wrong answer here. Was Joel right? Do his actions make him a bad guy? Would you have done the same thing?
Hit that Leave a Comment button up there and tell me what you think.
THE LAST OF US SPOILERS AHEAD, obvi
By Peter Marsh
Alright so I've said this once ... but I'll say it again.
If you haven't watched all of season one of The Last of Us, and you'd like to experience it without spoilers, get out now. Now is the time to leave.
Seriously, go. Git.
Last chance.
Still here? Let's dig in.
