Stephen A. Smith and Dan Le Batard’s back and forth over the past several months finally came to a head as the two spoke live on Smith’s podcast.
Smith had Le Batard on “The Stephen A. Smith Show” on Sept. 6 to address their disagreement surrounding the state of sports media. The 40-minute discussion was streamed on Smith’s YouTube channel.
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The two, who used to be colleagues at ESPN (DIS) -), remained civil during their conversation, with both addressing early on that there’s mutual respect for the other person.
“We’re friends, we’re brothers, you know I love you,” Smith said.
Le Batard mentioned that he’s witnessed Smith’s rise over the last three decades, watching him turn into one of sports media’s most powerful voices.
“My admiration for you runs deep,” Le Batard said. “I know what you had to slither around and climb over to get where it is that you’ve gotten.”
After exchanging pleasantries, the two got to the core of what they’ve been arguing about for months: Le Batard believes that debate television — of which Smith is the face — has lowered the quality of sports journalism and has been a detriment to the humanization of athletes.
“We have decided with argument television — which took the acid that was sports radio and put lighter fluid all over it — created an environment that I believe is crueler to the athlete than it needs to be and celebrates sports less than it should,” Le Batard posited.
He said he believes Skip Bayless, Smith’s former “First Take” partner and now the face of FS1’s “Undisputed," is the “hood ornament” for why athletes don’t like the media, citing Bayless' stark criticisms of superstars like LeBron James and Russell Westbrook.
“What happens after that, I believe, is that the athlete becomes slightly less human when it becomes not about winning the games but about winning an argument,” Le Batard said.
Smith said he didn’t take any offense to Le Batard’s description of Bayless, but rebutted by saying he didn’t think Bayless, who brought Smith to “First Take” over a decade ago, was the origin of this type of behavior that has dehumanized athletes.
“What I take offense to is you acting as if it started with Skip Bayless or it started with ‘First Take,’” Smith said.
Smith said that other reporters, including respected media members like ESPN’s Michael Wilbon, have been critical about athletes on shows like ESPN’s “Pardon The Interruption,” which came before “First Take," or in different mediums such as newspaper columns.
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Le Batard retorted by saying it’s all up to “perspective” as to whether Smith and debate television have made the quality of the media coverage of sports better or worse.
“I've seen ‘First Take’ go from the most criticized show that ESPN has to its signature show. And that may be because of the way you've elevated ‘First Take’ or it may be because some of your surroundings have also been depleted because journalism has in many instances, left the building,” Le Batard said, to which Smith seemed to agree.
He also suggested a few more points regarding ESPN and it lowering the quality of journalism for the sake of viewership numbers.
“I understand that my bosses need to make money and this is a business but I will make the argument that this is where some journalism somewhere gets contaminated by some of these conflicts of interest in the newsrooms,” Le Batard said.
Smith actually agreed with Le Batard for his point on the business side of journalism, but said this should be a criticism of media at large and not just sports media.
This led into a hilarious discussion between the two where Smith pointed out that “The Dan Le Batard Show” had satirical segments that may not be considered the highest quality of journalism.
“You talked about [‘First Take’] being dumb, or doing dumb things, and I'm saying, ‘Wait a minute... have you seen some of the stuff that has happened on ‘The Dan Le Batard Show?’’” Smith said. “Now I find it funny. I find it comical. And I'm like it's no harm. You got an audience they love it.”
“You talked about the show being dumb…have you seen some of the stuff that happens on the Dan Le Batard Show?” - @stephenasmith
— Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz (@LeBatardShow) September 6, 2023
😂😂😂😂😂😂
📺 https://t.co/QYTqbFyL8M pic.twitter.com/VeKlCahFOz
Smith proceeded to say one of the most poignant moments of the conversation where he described Le Batard as “sanctimonious,” and said this is a description echoed by Wilbon. The "First Take" host said that Le Batard is “brilliant,” but that he needs to realize that not everyone else can be as great as him.
“You’re expecting other people to be up here,” Smith said. “You’re not appreciating that you’re up here ... Why don't you see that and look at things from that lens instead of saying, 'Damn, this is really pathetic. These people really got a problem and it's really degrading the quality of our industry.'"
Le Batard agreed that the criticism showered on him was fair.
"It is a terrible blind spot that you've just revealed to me that my arrogance is terribly unlikeable," Le Batard said. "They think an asshole is lecturing them, and it bothers them."
Smith’s concluding point was that his sharp criticism of athletes has always existed, even when he was a writer for the Philadelphia Inquirer. He thinks that there isn’t a limit to criticisms in sports, as long as it is not personal.
“The only limit all of us have: be respectful,” Smith said. “Don’t get personal and remember, you get to entertain and have a good time … there’s far more serious issues going on out there.”
Le Batard’s final counter that while this evolution of sports media and journalism have greatly benefited his career, he still doesn’t believe everyone is given a fair shake by this style.
“If you were the athlete, you might lament some things about the coverage,” Le Batard said. “I just think there’s a price to pay. It might not be a price that you and I are suffering.”
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