J. Smith-Cameron misses "Succession" too. "It's hard to get through your head that it's not continuing," the Emmy- and Tony-nominated actor admits, "but that's showbiz, as they say."
Now, after wrapping up four memorable seasons as the steely Gerri Kellman on the HBO hit, she's taking on an entirely different role in Peacock's new animated comedy "In the Know." As the much-maligned producer and “boomer witch” on a fictional public radio interview show, the theater-trained star gets to show off her acting skills using just her voice. "In the Know," which was co-created by Mike Judge of "King of the Hill," also pokes fun at both liberals and conservatives in a way that Judge does best. In our “Salon Talks” interview, Smith-Cameron, who is outspoken about her distaste for Trump, shared her frustrations with those on her own side, like how "we're sort of unable to fully rally behind our candidate ever."
During our discussion, Smith-Cameron also revealed the genesis of her iconic chemistry with her "Succession" co-star Kieran Culkin, the origin of the infamous phrase "slime puppy," and why she thinks their dynamic resonated so well with viewers. "It was kind of sexy," she said, "but in an unusual, unexpected way that sneaks up on people." She also talks about what attaining high-profile success later in her career has meant. "It's a win for middle-aged and older women everywhere," she said. "It has been proof that it's not over until it's over."
You can watch our full “Salon Talks” here or read a transcript of our conversation below.
This interview has been lightly edited for length and clarity.
This show is a workplace comedy with puppets. You play a very different character from Gerri. Tell me about Barb.
Barb is the producer of “In the Know.” It's an NPR type show, and Barb is sort of the straight man in a way, although she's funny too in her own right. She's slightly Midwestern and very earnest and gets the short end of the stick around the office a lot, unfairly, because she's really the den mother and she's kind to everyone and she keeps the thing going along.
This show pokes fun in a way that I only something Mike Judge affiliated could do by appealing to people on the left and on the right. It raises questions about those of us who consider ourselves progressive and interrogates our own hypocrisies and blind spots. You are outspoken about where you stand politically. Do you feel that the show is a reflection of the frustrations some of us on our side of the aisle feel with ourselves?
I definitely feel that way. It's kind of too bad that we're unable to fully rally behind our candidate ever. We're always nitpicking and virtue signaling a bit. It's too bad because the other side sort of plays dirty. I don't think we should play dirty, but I wish that we would toughen up and play offensive a little more, not just defensive.
You've done a lot of stage work. When people talk about you, they talk about your physicality. This is a very different skill set for you. What drew you to something that's so outside the box?
I've always thought it was interesting. Voice acting fascinates me. When I was a young actress, I had one job where I was hired to dub an actress's voice for a commercial. There was nothing wrong with her voice; they just wanted to make the character a little kookier without re-shooting the whole thing. I spent the whole day in the studio with cans on my ears and listening to her voice and just talking along with it and in between takes, I would hear it played back and I'd be like, "Wow, I really sound different than her."
Then they let me see a rough cut at the end of the day of my voice with her face and actions, and it was like a third person. She seemed to move faster than she did before. She seemed to make funnier faces. She seemed to be a little more peculiar because my voice is a little more peculiar than hers, and yet I wouldn't have recognized my voice.
It's this invisible but powerful part of performing, and I've been fascinated to explore it. Also the same woman who dubs me in French for “Succession” dubbed me in French for “Rectify,” and I'm fascinated by that. There's whole voice actor industry in France where they take that very, very seriously. I think there are really good trained actors for that.
This is also an interesting production because very often in voice work, the actors are in separate rooms. They record separately, but this was a really collaborative process.
That's true. They had us come and come to LA and we ran around the table some and we talked about it some, and then we got in the booth together, all of us, so we could play off each other. They even made note of our facial expressions and the way we would gesticulate, and they worked that into it a bit, so I would say it was unusually collaborative. Then we did a lot of more specific ADR post-production stuff on our own in the booth. Me, from New York, and everyone from where they were.
Speaking of collaborative performances, I have to ask you about “Succession.” You're coming off this award season where it has done very well, but it's also been a with this cast because it's been almost a year since you wrapped shooting. What has it been like having this somewhat bittersweet experience, because you're not going to see each other again in that professional way?
I know. It's so sad.
You seem very snuggly with Kieran Culkin.
Well, Kieran and I go way back, and then we just had to do such peculiar things on the show that we had to be tight or else. But he just loves to tease and give everyone a hard time. He's into insult humor, so he's his own thing. But Sarah Snook and Matthew Macfadyen and really all of them, Brian [Cox], Alan Ruck, I just got so close with all of them. We all did. Zoe Winters who played Kerry, she and I are now writing partners. We're trying to write something together. We became very close.
But it is bittersweet because it felt to us all that the show was just hitting its prime in a way. I can objectively see why Jesse [Armstrong] and the writers decided to end it where they did because of the family story, the succession story—after all, it's called “Succession”—needed to wind up, but the rest of it was just reaching a fever pitch. The whole election thing, and the corrupt big business stuff is just as relevant as ever, if not more. And so, I mean, it's sort of disappointing or hard to get through your head that it's not continuing, but that's show biz, as they say.
But you get to leave the room with everybody wanting more, I guess.
Including ourselves.
This was not a role that was written for a woman. This was not a role that was going to be this pivotal character. And then very early on, you became "indispensable." Tell me about how that happens. There must have been something in the chemistry, not just with Kieran, but with the whole environment, with the writers and with the cast.
It was a very collaborative way that they worked. For one thing, at the end of every scene, they would give us what Mark Mylod called a “freebie,” which would be kind of do whatever you want, even if it meant saying something different. Then sometimes we would improv even when it wasn't the freebie and they would incorporate it. And also, I just think with that character, somehow I just got this idea for her. In my mind, it came off the text, but I mean, it was written for a guy, so I'm not sure what was intentional.
What I got from it was this very driven woman who is extremely capable, but sort of a nervous wreck. It was very specific, and there were opportunities for her to be funny, and I saw her in glasses and I just saw her. And they welcomed that. They wanted actors to supply a lot of the character. You can see it with Nick Braun or Kieran, how they almost are written in their own cadence or Connor with Alan Ruck. It's sort of informed by the way their personalities are as well.
When you talk about those freebies or that improv, you came up with “slime puppy.”
I mean, we'd run out of dialogue, but they kept the camera rolling, so I had to come up with worse and worse things to call him.
I would never in a thousand years come up with slime puppy.
I don't know where it came from. I guess I was just inspired by Kieran.
Was it the first time you'd ever used that phrase in your life or to do you throw that one out a lot?
Certainly not.
Were you surprised with the reaction? That pairing, people have gone out of their minds for. What do you think it is about that sick twisted dynamic between these two twisted people that just people are fascinated with?
I don't know. It feels funny to say this myself, but I think somehow there's something kind of specifically sexy about it. We have a rapport, Kieran and I, and it's so unexpected. Our ages are different, and you see the age difference, but with the sexes reversed quite a lot, so it was kind of refreshing and to have something so unexpected. For my character, she was at the beginning so nonplussed every time he would flirt with me, I'd be like, "What? What are you talking about?" That just riled him up more. That seemed to be what turned him on was me being kind of mean with him. That doesn't answer your question, except I think it was kind of sexy, but in an unusual, unexpected way that sneaks up on people, maybe.
You have been working... I almost don't want to say it, for 40 years.
That means I started when I was about eight.
Obviously, you were a baby.
You've had a great deal of acclaim. You've had a great deal of steady work. And yet you have this breakthrough that takes your profile to a different level. Not to in any way diminish anything else that's come before, but you now are at a much wider level of recognition in your sixties. Again, not that you're in your sixties, but if you were in your sixties.
If I were.
What does it mean to have this come to you at this stage of life?
Well, it's fantastic. It's fantastic, and I feel it's a win for middle-aged and older women everywhere. I was perfectly content with my career the way it was. I felt like I did really meaningful things in the theater, film, and TV all the time, and I loved it. I wasn't someone who expected fame or fortune, so I wasn't looking for it. But it's been great. It has been proof that it's not over until it's over.
It's not over, but we are living in a very changing world. I saw you on X recently talking about AI. It's concerning.
So concerning.
As someone whose face could be manipulated, whose voice could be taken away from her, what are you looking at and thinking about as you're going forward in your career as a creative person?
This was one of the big points of the strike. It's very hard to resolve. Molly Shannon and I were talking about it, that it almost seems like something the government's going to have to come in and regulate. It wasn't clear at the beginning of the internet all the pitfalls with that and privacy, and then, how there had to be steps taken, measures taken to protect people. I'm hoping that that becomes the case here because I don't even think we can glimpse the ramifications.
Some of it's obvious. There was already an article in the paper about a manipulated AI version of Joe Biden being used erroneously in a campaign ad, so it's very scary. I saw a thing also in the Times, I think, where they showed you faces and you had to guess which ones were AI and I didn't get any of them right.
It's really scary and I don't think we even know how big it's going to be, but I'm just hoping that it'll become clear to all parties somehow that it's got to be regulated somehow. I don't know how that is. I don't think we know the size of it yet.
I want to ask you one more thing, because you are such a busy lady. You're also going to be in a film version of John Green's “Turtles All the Way Down,” one of my favorite YA books of all time. Tell me about that, and some of the other things we can look forward to seeing or at least hearing you in.
Yes, I did that movie and that was delightful. That's a story about a young woman who has OCD and she's just crippled by it. She's this beautiful, sweet young girl and she can't have a relationship 'cause she's got so many issues with it. She discovers a scientist on the internet who fascinates her about what she says about it. I play that character. She goes to listen to her on a campus and they have a meaningful scene that sort of helps her a bit.
It's very poignant and it's very relatable, I think, whether you have that issue or your own thing because everybody's got something. John Green was on set and he is lovely, and I loved the whole cast and director and everybody. It was a good experience. We shot in Cincinnati, which is cool. I had never spent any time there.
And we're going to get you back on the stage.
Yes, I am going to do a play in London next year it looks like, but they can't quite announce that yet. We don't have the particulars.
