Ben Roberts-Smith told another soldier “I just want to kill cunts” while on deployment in Afghanistan, and had pictures of slain insurgents on an iPod during training, the federal court has heard.
A former SAS soldier, now an officer still serving in the Australian Defence Force, was subpoenaed to give evidence to Roberts-Smith’s defamation hearing this week. He was anonymised before the court as Person Two.
Roberts-Smith is suing the Age, the Sydney Morning Herald and the Canberra Times over reports he alleges are defamatory and portray him as committing war crimes, including murder, as well as acts of bullying and domestic violence.
The newspapers are pleading a defence of truth. Roberts-Smith denies any wrongdoing.
Person Two was a witness for the newspapers.
He told the court he was posted alongside Roberts-Smith on “picket duty” in a big bunker area during deployment in Afghanistan in 2006.
Person Two said Roberts-Smith told him: “I just want to kill cunts. I don’t give a fuck, I just want to kill cunts.”
Person Two also testified that sitting on a bus following a parachute training course in Australia, Roberts-Smith pulled out an iPod, leaned over the seat of another soldier, and said “hey check this out”.
He then allegedly showed the other soldiers photographs of “dead insurgents” on the device.
Person Two was a member of Roberts-Smith’s patrol in 2006, including for a mission on a mountain called Koran Ghar above the Chora Pass in Afghanistan’s Uruzgan province.
The five-man patrol had carried 60kg packs to the top of the mountain during a 10-hour overnight climb to set up an observation post, watching over the valley, which was to be the scene of an allied assault.
On the second day of the observation mission, Person Two and another soldier spotted a young Afghan male – “about 14 or 15 years old”, Person Two told the court – walking on a goat-track, near to the observation post.
He said the teenager was not armed with a weapon, nor carrying a radio or wearing webbing. Person Two said he did not believe the young man had seen the Australian soldiers and so did not open fire on him.
Person Two told the court Roberts-Smith and another soldier, Sergeant Matt Locke, came down to the observation post from another position and berated the soldiers on lookout duty, saying “‘why the fuck didn’t you shoot him?”.
“I said ‘because we’re in an observation post’.”
Person Two explained to the court: “The task for the mission was to observe and surveil … not to become decisively engaged. That was to be avoided at all costs, because it then affects your ability to complete your larger mission.”
The court heard Roberts-Smith and Locke ran off after the teenager. Person Two said “about a minute later, two minutes later, I heard four or five shots, a suppressed M4 and a suppressed SR 25”. Those were the two weapons carried by Roberts-Smith and Locke, Person Two told the court.
The shooting of the Afghan man attracted an insurgent attack, the court heard in evidence this week. Roberts-Smith’s patrol became engaged in a fierce firefight for several hours, encircled on the mountaintop and under direct attack from Taliban fighters. They were ultimately able to get down the mountain, but only after calling in aerial support to attack the insurgent positions.
Roberts-Smith and Locke, later killed in action, were both awarded the Medal for Gallantry for their actions on the mountaintop.
Person Two told the court he did not believe the initial engagement of the lone young Afghan male was justified.
“I don’t believe the engagement was legitimate, because our task for the mission was to observe and surveil. By engaging that male, it compromised the observation post, it compromised our mission.”
In his evidence before the court last year, Roberts-Smith said the man was a legitimate military target who was moving suspiciously. When he shot the man, Roberts-Smith said a flare – “what you typically get when ordnance goes off or detonates” – came off chest webbing the man was wearing.
Under cross-examination, Person Two was forced to defend his evidence.
Bruce McClintock said the conversation where Roberts-Smith allegedly expressed a bloodlust “to kill” “never happened”.
“You’ve entirely fabricated that Person Two,” McClintock said.
“No, I did not,” Person Two said.
McClintock also put it two Person Two that there were no photographs of dead insurgents, and that Roberts-Smith did not even own an iPod with a screen in 2006, when the alleged incident was said to have taken place.
“Once again, you have entirely fabricated this, haven’t you?”
“No, I haven’t.”
Under cross-examination, Person Two said he had met with the journalist Chris Masters. Notes from Masters discussed in court revealed he disclosed information about his deployments and operations. Masters is one of the respondents in this trial.
The trial, before Justice Anthony Besanko, continues.
